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Kollel Iyun Hadaf, Jerusalem

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Chulin 39

CHULIN 37-40 - sponsored by Dr. Lindsay A. Rosenwald of Lawrence NY, in honor of his father, David ben Aharon ha'Levy Rosenwald of blessed memory.


(a) If someone Shechts an animal with the intention of sprinkling its blood for Avodah-Zarah, Rebbi Yochanan declares it Pasul, Resh Lakish declares it Kasher.
What is the basis of their Machlokes?

(b) In which similar case by Behemas Kodshim do they also argue?

(c) Having presented their Machlokes in the case of ...

  1. ... 'ha'Shochet Lizrok Damah la'Avodas-Kochavim', why do they need to repeat the Machlokes by 'Shachtah li'Shemah ... '?
  2. ... 'Shachtah li'Shemah ... ', why do they need to repeat the Machlokes by 'ha'Shochet Lizrok Damah la'Avodas-Kochavim'?
(a) Rav Sheishes queries both Rebbi Yochanan and Resh Lakish from Rebbi Yossi's 'Kal va'Chomer in our Mishnah.
When the Tana says that by Chulin, a Machshavah does not render Pasul - why can he not mean this literally?

(b) Then what *does* he mean?

(c) What does Rav Sheishes now ask on ...

  1. ... Resh Lakish? What does he extrapolate from Rebbi Yossi's Lashon 'u'Mah be'Makom she'ha'Machshavah *Poseles* be'Mukdashin'?
  2. ... Rebbi Yochanan?
(a) How do we answer the Kashya on Resh Lakish? What did he initially think when he heard from Rebbi Yochanan that Mechashvin me'Avodah la'Avodah, bi'Fenim?

(b) Rav Sheishes answers the Kashya on Rebbi Yochanan by establishing Rebbi Yossi by the four Avodos? Which four Avodos?

(c) How will he then explain 'Makom she'Ein Machshavah Poseles, be'Chulin'?
How is Chulin inferior to Kodshim in this regard?

(a) From where do we know that Machshavah by the Shechitah and the Zerikah invalidate by Avodah-Zarah, but not by the Kabalah and the Holachah?

(b) Why does Machshavah by the Haktarah, which certainly pertains to Avodah Zarah, not invalidate?

Answers to questions



(a) We cite a Beraisa in support of Rebbi Yochanan.
What does the Tana there rule in a case where someone Shechts an animal in order to sprinkle its blood or to burn its Cheilev for Avodah-Zarah?

(b) What did Rav Chisda say in a case where he had such a Machshavah, but only after the completion of the Shechitah?

(c) And he suggested that they did not forbid the animal out of deference to the Rabbanan (who do not consider S'tam Machsheves Oved-Kochavim la'Avodas-Kochavim).
Why did they not permit it?

(d) What objection do we raise to Rav Chisda's dual statements? Why, in this case, might ...

  1. ... the Rabbanan concede to Rebbi Eliezer that the Shechitah is Pasul?
  2. ... Rebbi Eliezer concede to the Rabbanan that the Shechitah is Kasher?
(a) So Rav Shizbi establishes that they declined to permit it, in deference to Raban Shimon ben Gamliel.
What principle of Raban Shimon ben Gamliel is he referring to?

(b) We cite the Mishnah in Gitin, which rules that if a healthy man asks the people present to write his wife a Get, they are not in fact, his Sheluchim, and the Get that they write is invalid.
Why not?

(c) What did Raban Shimon ben Gamliel rule, when such a case actually occurred, and after they had already written the Get and given it to the man's wife, he subsequently climbed on to the roof and fell off and died?

(d) How do we solve the problem, that the story with Raban Shimon ben Gamliel seems to contradict the Mishnah's initial ruling?

(a) What do we try to prove from there?

(b) How do we reject the proof? Why is that case different than the case that we are trying to resolve?

(c) So Ravina cites a Beraisa where Re'uven, a Yisrael on his death-bed, writes his property, including Avadim Cana'anim, to Shimon, who is a Kohen and who declines to accept them.
On what grounds does the Tana Kama permit the Avadim to eat Terumah?

(d) What does Raban Shimon ben Gamliel say?

(a) What problem do we have with the Tana Kama's ruling? (b) What does Rabah say about a case where Shimon ...
  1. ... refuses to accept Reuven's gift from the outset?
  2. ... accepts the gift, protesting only after receiving it, that he does not want it?
(c) How does he then establish the Machlokes?

(d) The Chachamim hold that due to his initial silence, he has acquired the property.
What does Raban Shimon ben Gamliel say?

(e) Then why was he initially silent?

9) Regarding the Machlokes between the Chachamim, Rebbi Eliezer and Rebbi Yossi, like whom does Rav Yehudah Amar Shmuel rule?


(a) What did the Arabs who came to Tzikunya stipulate when they gave the Jewish Shochtim some rams to Shecht?

(b) Why would Arabs require their animals to be Shechted? If they were too busy to kill the rams themselves, why did they not give them to Nochri butchers to kill?

(c) Rav Tuvi bar Rav Masna sent them to Rav Yosef to ask whether the skin and the flesh were permitted.
What did he reply?

(d) Rav Acha b'rei de'Rav Ivya asked Rav Ashi what the Din would be, according to Rebbi Eliezer, in a case where a Nochri gave a Shochet a Zuz for a piece of meat; whether the entire animal would be forbidden because of that one Zuz-worth or not.
What did he reply?

Answers to questions

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